2jzgte swap advice

[pwpanas]

Originally Posted by normalsalaryman

i forgot to tell you, when i bought the engine it was only complete engine+wiring+ecu+ stupid tranny... thats it. so no intercooler,exhaust except from the cefiro which is rb20e engine. and the car had a busted suspension...so pretty much i have to start from a scratch. and where i live to get the oem exhaust,intercooler,pipping and so on is nearly impossible. and i was starting to look for the v160 tranny last year and i still cant find it until today, either in my country or the neighbour country eg malaysia,singapore,thailand.. did find 1 in australia but my stupid country taxes are forbiding me to get it at reasonable price, it would cost me almost 4times of the price you pay for one of those in your country.. and oh yeah i was reading your link on BPU mods and thank god i wasnt wrong when i decided to go with 2jzgte
and. yeah i would continue to read everything on the 2jz engine on the net.

car will be done in feb and i cant barely wait to ride the jz.

anyway sorry if i did annoyed you with my noobest knowledge of turbo jz capabilities

ya cal=california

to be honest around 500hp was not my original goals, its just im aware that i have a weak tranny that might(not sure) handle only around 500 at max and i did not find a way yet to either smugle orsome other way to import the v160 at reasonable price to my place. so im assuming i would be stuck at that amount of hp for sometime

just to get you an idea i was paying around $5800usd for the motors and the outside condition was like its ready to get thrown to a trash can(dirty looks). and if youre lucky there maybe only 1 or 2 jz engine that get through my country in a year and most of them are auto's and i heard there is someone selling 2jz for $7500 engine,wiring,5spdtranny

but once i get v160 in my hand, i would certainly go aroun 1000hp.

Matt, I hope my posts were helpful - no need to apologize.

Bummer about the V160 procurement difficulties. Wish I could help with that somehow. I wonder if any junkyard dealers in Japan would be willing to export - perhaps with the commonality of the Mkiv Supra there, a V160/161 could be sold for a reasonable enough price...thereby lowering your overall costs (including taxes) enough to make it a practical proposition...

Maybe this is a dumb question, but why not start with something like a Lexus IS300 or SC300? If those weren't sold in Indonesia, why not at least pick some sort of Toyota - even a Solara might have worked:
http://urbanracer.com/articles/anmviewer.asp?a=1353

Good luck with your project and please stay in touch.

Kind regards,
Phil

[normalsalaryman]

Originally Posted by pwpanas

Matt, I hope my posts were helpful - no need to apologize.

Bummer about the V160 procurement difficulties. Wish I could help with that somehow. I wonder if any junkyard dealers in Japan would be willing to export - perhaps with the commonality of the Mkiv Supra there, a V160/161 could be sold for a reasonable enough price...thereby lowering your overall costs (including taxes) enough to make it a practical proposition...

Maybe this is a dumb question, but why not start with something like a Lexus IS300 or SC300? If those weren't sold in Indonesia, why not at least pick some sort of Toyota - even a Solara might have worked:
http://urbanracer.com/articles/anmviewer.asp?a=1353

Good luck with your project and please stay in touch.

Kind regards,
Phil

phil, your advice was a great boost of knowledge to me, such a simple thing yet gives great amount of extra rwhp.

well the last president was giving us a great deal (easier import rules and taxes) but unfortunately hes only sits as a president for 1years only and i dont know how that rules is no longer valid with this new president which already be a president for 9year.

the only cheapest option to build a RWD car is either corrola dx,a31cefiro,toyota crown <93 models (newer one is expensive and only a high official eg minister rides it),bmw 3or5 series and pretty much thats all the list of cheap RWD car in my country. prices tart from $1000 to max price is around $11-13k

thing like is250,soarer,mkiv supra and most of the sports car is way to pricey starts from $30k to a doesnt make sense pricing.

there is only 3 jza80(not sure about the code) and the 2004 S2000 goes for $60k. but most of the sports car average prices sits around $50k due to 200-250% of the car taxes which is a killing. that taxing percentage also for 2nd hand imported engine and tranny too.

and the rest cheap RWD car that commonly available is either SUV or a Van and some of them is a wagon..

thats why i was going with a31cefiro. and ya i will keep my project updated once i got back home...

[pwpanas]

Originally Posted by normalsalaryman

phil, your advice was a great boost of knowledge to me, such a simple thing yet gives great amount of extra rwhp.

well the last president was giving us a great deal (easier import rules and taxes) but unfortunately hes only sits as a president for 1years only and i dont know how that rules is no longer valid with this new president which already be a president for 9year.

the only cheapest option to build a RWD car is either corrola dx,a31cefiro,toyota crown <93 models (newer one is expensive and only a high official eg minister rides it),bmw 3or5 series and pretty much thats all the list of cheap RWD car in my country. prices tart from $1000 to max price is around $11-13k

thing like is250,soarer,mkiv supra and most of the sports car is way to pricey starts from $30k to a doesnt make sense pricing.

there is only 3 jza80(not sure about the code) and the 2004 S2000 goes for $60k. but most of the sports car average prices sits around $50k due to 200-250% of the car taxes which is a killing. that taxing percentage also for 2nd hand imported engine and tranny too.

and the rest cheap RWD car that commonly available is either SUV or a Van and some of them is a wagon..

thats why i was going with a31cefiro. and ya i will keep my project updated once i got back home...

If you don't mind me pointing this out, the 2jz-gte is not an inexpensive engine to run. Among many other things, it requires fully synthetic oil and race fuel (and/or water-meth injection, or E85) at higher boost levels.

A 2jz-gte (with high boost) also puts out enough horsepower that (perhaps) the a31cefiro chassis and/or brakes won't be able to handle it. There's a good reason the jza80 chassis+engine is $30K+ - it's because the entire automotive system was engineered together (by Toyota and TRD of course) to handle all of the power potential and other performance characteristics (braking, handling, aerodynamics, traction, etc., etc.).

Have you heard the expression "there is no such thing as a free lunch"? If not, it means you'll always end up paying one way or another - in time/labor, frustration, rework, risk, etc. Although I definitely wish you luck with your project no matter what you decide, I have to let you know I'm quite skeptical about your (apparent) goal of trying to do it all really cheaply. Alternatively, you may wish to consider working longer and/or harder and saving up the $ to purchase the Mkiv Toyota Supra Turbo that it seems you may really want. I can assure you that it will be worth the wait...

[normalsalaryman]

Originally Posted by pwpanas

If you don't mind me pointing this out, the 2jz-gte is not an inexpensive engine to run. Among many other things, it requires fully synthetic oil and race fuel (and/or water-meth injection, or E85) at higher boost levels.

A 2jz-gte (with high boost) also puts out enough horsepower that (perhaps) the a31cefiro chassis and/or brakes won't be able to handle it. There's a good reason the jza80 chassis+engine is $30K+ - it's because the entire automotive system was engineered together (by Toyota and TRD of course) to handle all of the power potential and other performance characteristics (braking, handling, aerodynamics, traction, etc., etc.).

Have you heard the expression "there is no such thing as a free lunch"? If not, it means you'll always end up paying one way or another - in time/labor, frustration, rework, risk, etc. Although I definitely wish you luck with your project no matter what you decide, I have to let you know I'm quite skeptical about your (apparent) goal of trying to do it all really cheaply. Alternatively, you may wish to consider working longer and/or harder and saving up the $ to purchase the Mkiv Toyota Supra Turbo that it seems you may really want. I can assure you that it will be worth the wait...

no no, you get me wrong to think that i want the cheapest stuff...when i say $30k is something like cheapest sports car like toyota celica the one with 2zzengine.

jza80 pricing sits at $95k the whole complete car on auto tranny..

as for the a31 cefiro body to hold lets say 1000hp to be honest i wasnt sure if the body would handle that much power even i did reinforced trying to increase the body rigids steps. i guess we will know after the car is done.

and for the fuel originaly we only have 98 octane for the highest quality fuel, but i have the acces to get the race fuel like vp or avgas(thats what we called it) easy.

as in for amount of money would be blown to mods the car, i am familiar with that. as i do own 2 honda eg fully race built. so i know faster=more money.

what i've been posting about 2jz is that i get the impression from the forum that you can go pretty cheap with 2jz for certain amount of money, and i do aware if i want to go 700hp+ equal to big money involved.

and i've been wondering about how cheap you can go on the 2jz for lower that 500hp because i planned to daily the car. im talking about the longevity of the engine assuming i did all the thing right if i go the cheapest way.thats why i've been asking all the guru's or experienced guys such as your self on this forum phill. and im trying my best to get it right for the first time for the turbo engine.

lets say most of the advice is telling me to go expensive, i wouldnt mind that

anyway if i do have an aftermarket ECU will i still need BCC to run higher boost on oem TT without having a fuel cut? and if i do still need BCC on upgraded ECU what brand i should go with for the BCC since the only BCC brand that i know is greddy and its discontinued.

thx
Matt

[pwpanas]

Originally Posted by normalsalaryman

no no, you get me wrong to think that i want the cheapest stuff...when i say $30k is something like cheapest sports car like toyota celica the one with 2zzengine.

jza80 pricing sits at $95k the whole complete car on auto tranny..

as for the a31 cefiro body to hold lets say 1000hp to be honest i wasnt sure if the body would handle that much power even i did reinforced trying to increase the body rigids steps. i guess we will know after the car is done.

and for the fuel originaly we only have 98 octane for the highest quality fuel, but i have the acces to get the race fuel like vp or avgas(thats what we called it) easy.

as in for amount of money would be blown to mods the car, i am familiar with that. as i do own 2 honda eg fully race built. so i know faster=more money.

what i've been posting about 2jz is that i get the impression from the forum that you can go pretty cheap with 2jz for certain amount of money, and i do aware if i want to go 700hp+ equal to big money involved.

and i've been wondering about how cheap you can go on the 2jz for lower that 500hp because i planned to daily the car. im talking about the longevity of the engine assuming i did all the thing right if i go the cheapest way.thats why i've been asking all the guru's or experienced guys such as your self on this forum phill. and im trying my best to get it right for the first time for the turbo engine.

lets say most of the advice is telling me to go expensive, i wouldnt mind that

anyway if i do have an aftermarket ECU will i still need BCC to run higher boost on oem TT without having a fuel cut? and if i do still need BCC on upgraded ECU what brand i should go with for the BCC since the only BCC brand that i know is greddy and its discontinued.

thx
Matt

you're right - a BCC is only needed with the oem 2jz-gte ecu. Still, my other BPU advice still applies - you need a downpipe (bypassing the catalytic converters), a boost gauge, and a boost controller long before you need to spend money on a big intercooler or a huge 4"+ aftermarket exhaust...

500rwhp is not really a cost-effective point for the 2jz-gte. you could do:

- 350rwhp on pump gas, using the oem twins
...(if you're very careful about controlling boost precisely)
- 425rwhp on race fuel or alcohol, using the oem twins

- 475rwhp on pump gas, using a moderate size single turbo, & fuel system
...(if you're very careful about controlling boost precisely)
- 650rwhp or so on race fuel or alcohol, using a moderate size single turbo & fuel system

for the 2jz-gte, those are your most cost effective points

oh, note that avgas is not the same as race fuel. avgas is aviation fuel, which is chemically engineered to run best at higher altitudes. it has the wrong % of long-chain hydrocarbons to effectively power a turbocharged car engine at ground level.

[normalsalaryman]

Originally Posted by pwpanas

you're right - a BCC is only needed with the oem 2jz-gte ecu. Still, my other BPU advice still applies - you need a downpipe (bypassing the catalytic converters), a boost gauge, and a boost controller long before you need to spend money on a big intercooler or a huge 4"+ aftermarket exhaust...

500rwhp is not really a cost-effective point for the 2jz-gte. you could do:

- 350rwhp on pump gas, using the oem twins
...(if you're very careful about controlling boost precisely)
- 425rwhp on race fuel or alcohol, using the oem twins

- 475rwhp on pump gas, using a moderate size single turbo, & fuel system
...(if you're very careful about controlling boost precisely)
- 650rwhp or so on race fuel or alcohol, using a moderate size single turbo & fuel system

for the 2jz-gte, those are your most cost effective points

oh, note that avgas is not the same as race fuel. avgas is aviation fuel, which is chemically engineered to run best at higher altitudes. it has the wrong % of long-chain hydrocarbons to effectively power a turbocharged car engine at ground level.

talking about Avgas been wondering if you know much about that stuff, most of the people backhome has been saying avgas has same number of octane as the vp, BUT i did try once it does no different in term of acceleration, but my engine temperature is raising rapidly..almost twice hotter than a vp fuel. and somehow my idle is higher than normal it does when im running on vp fuel...on an NA engine

i dont know if avgas act like that or if you ever try and experience different..

[pwpanas]

Originally Posted by normalsalaryman

talking about Avgas been wondering if you know much about that stuff, most of the people backhome has been saying avgas has same number of octane as the vp, BUT i did try once it does no different in term of acceleration, but my engine temperature is raising rapidly..almost twice hotter than a vp fuel. and somehow my idle is higher than normal it does when im running on vp fuel...on an NA engine

i dont know if avgas act like that or if you ever try and experience different..

Yep that's consistent. The very cold air in high altitudes is also a factor in how avgas is formulated. Please stick with VP fuel or methanol injection or E85 to eliminate detonation when using the 2jz-gte at high boost.

[warmkop]

Sorry for taking long to replay my internet was off.
People here use the w58 boks to drag with because the v160 is so scares and expensive. It will handle the 500hp but it depends on your driving if you drive hard it, won't last long.

If you can use the oem ecu its much better then an aftermarket one.
Aftermarket ecu take a lot of tuning to get perfect.
On the exhaust side you don't have a choice so you're doing an engine swap into another car so you need to get an exhaust made up for you wile you busy do it from the downpipe.

[normalsalaryman]

Originally Posted by warmkop

People here use the w58 boks to drag with because the v160 is so scares and expensive. It will handle the 500hp but it depends on your driving if you drive hard it, won't last long.

wait i kinda dont get what you mean by driving it hard, hard as in throwing the gear change lik roughly or under hard acceleration but gentle gear shift?.

cus i was planing to daily my car, and most probably i will drive the car like full acceleration(not from dead stop) most of the time,but since im a gentle shifter guy so i wont be thrasing on shifting...will that consider as hard driving?

and ya since i only have engine+tranny+ecu and wiring only when i bought the engine, so i will definitely do a custom upgraded full exhaust system, big intercooler,custom pipping and upgraded radiator, since the old car had a busted radiator and busted suspension. but i will definitely do a general inspection on the engine internal including the gearbox too..

even most of the stuff is custom made and temporarily targeting at 500hp as the entrance power, we're building all he thing to a 1000hp standart equipment in mind, so once i found the v160 box i can just fit the new boxs and big turbo and bam here we go 1000hp car without having to replace the other part first, before i can achieve 1000hp fix this and that, so its like one way build like 1000hp standart equipment but instead of big turbo i went with oem turbo while waiting for the v160boxs.