start up fail help!!!! - Page 2

El_supracabra · 03-17-2011, 02:11 AM

Yes it is a 7mge. OF COURSE I used assembly lube. Lol

I was wondering if maybe the flywheel was too thick or something (perhaps causing the pressure plate not to release the clutch? Idk)

I'm not home right this minute, but I will def try to turn the motor "backwards" by hand a little to "dislodge" or realign whatever is "jamming". I think my clutch cylinder may need to be bled. Weird considering I didnt disconnect any hydraulic clutch lines. I did notice my resevoir was almost empty.... But that still wouldn't cause the thing to lock up that tight. I'm wondering if maybe I should loosen the bellhousing bolts a little to see if that helps loosen things up? Or maybe put it in gear and try to turn the driveshaft?

Anyways thanks a lot guys. Keep the suggestions coming, and I will def let you know what I find!

El_supracabra · 03-17-2011, 02:19 AM

Oh and yes I did use a new clutch it was Autozone brand, I used to work there and I've never seen one of there clutches come back. So I figured it was as good as any. The only prob I had was that the bolt holes in the pressure plate didn't line up with the boltholes in the new AM flywheel. I just blamed it on craptastic aftermarket compatibility and drilled new holes in the PXplate. Seemed to bolt up great after that.

Travis89Turbo · 03-17-2011, 02:27 AM

Start with the easy stuff first. Pull the other two plugs and check in the cylinders for fuel (or anti freeze, but that's un likely), then try rotating engine with by rachet, re check timing, recheck dist is installed properly. Double check plug wire routing. then if no more ideas pull trans. But I doubt anything is goin on in there. Which is quite the job with engine in!

El_supracabra · 03-17-2011, 06:12 AM

Ok I was about to write a hateful email to CBhaus (regarding the flywheel because I had to drill holes in the pressure plate in order for it to bolt up and i was suspecting that it was causing my "lock up" problems)...

....when i noticed that i had ordered the flywheel for *TURBO ONLY*!!! WTF how did i miss the HUGE ASTERISKS that said *TURBO ONLY* ......sigh....well, i think i found the problem guys.....strangely, they LOOKED identical! AND they have the same number of teeth.

So what is the difference???? Do you guys think this is DEF the prob?

btwilson86 · 03-17-2011, 08:02 AM

I was pretty sure that the turbo flywheel is a larger diameter, by about an inch. I'm not 100% sure, but if thats the case then the flywheel may be jammed against the bellhousing on your w58.

El_supracabra · 03-17-2011, 09:08 PM

Idk this isn't really sitting right with me for some reason. When i got the flywheel I laid it on top of the old flywheel and checked to see if it had the same number of teeth. It was the SAME size and everything. But I crawled under the car today and loosened the bellhousing bolts and I got the engine to turn over (by ratchet) about 1/8-1/4". It wasn't very much but it was more than before.

Can anybody confirm the differences in the W58 and R154 flywheels?

Either way, I'm dropping the tranny next week so I will def be getting to the bottom of this! I'll keep you posted.

btwilson86 · 03-18-2011, 07:22 AM

I can't find reliable sources to confirm this, but what I've read on some other forums and sites is this:

7MGE: 225mm Overall Diameter
7MGTE: 240mm Overall Diameter

El_supracabra · 03-23-2011, 01:54 PM

THEY ARE EXACTLY THE SAME IN DIAMETER. HOWEVER, THE 7MGTE/R154 FLYWHEEL IS ABOUT 3/8" THICKER THAN THE ONE FOR THE 7MGE//W58!!!!

This is absolutely critical! what happened: I accidentally ordered a flywheel for a Turbo supra. (r154 trans) it was so thick that it positioned the pressure plate nearly 1/2" further towards the rear of the bellhousing. once the bellhousing bolts are tightened down, it binds the pressure plate into the bellhousing and the whole thing locks up tight! VERY VERY IMPORTANT to know!!!

Every thing else is the same, number of teeth, overall diameter, bolt pattern, inside whole diameter. The ONLY other thing that MIGHT be different, is the PATTERN of threaded holes for the PRESSURE PLATE BOLTS. i had to ream the pressure plate holes in order for them to line up with the threaded holes in the flywheel. this was my first clue that this was the incorrect flywheel. I made the mistake of thinking "its just the usual aftermarket compatibility".

On that note; I have a CHROME-MOLY lightweight flywheel for a turbo supra for sale now. LOL its never been used just bolted up. Ill take $150 firm
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CBHau...Q5fAccessories

cre · 03-23-2011, 06:06 PM

The flywheels are different in diameter. Been a while since I've had them side by side so I can't say how much.

If I recall correctly, the amount you shaved to bring it to 10.5:1 puts the engine very close to now being an "Interference" engine. If the mechanical timing was off by enough you may have hit the valves.

El_supracabra · 03-23-2011, 07:27 PM

I dropped the tranny last night, there were gouges in the inside of the bellhousing and scratches on the high points of the pressure plate.

I laid the "turbo only" flywheel on top of my OEM non-turbo flywheel and they were EXACTLY the same diameter and no of teeth.

when i laid them side by side the "turbo only" flywheel was about 3/8 to a 1/2" thicker than the OEM non turbo. this was the obvious problem. I had my OEM flywheel resurfaced and i will be putting it back on today. all things permitting.

03-17-2011, 02:11 AM	#11
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	Yes it is a 7mge. OF COURSE I used assembly lube. Lol I was wondering if maybe the flywheel was too thick or something (perhaps causing the pressure plate not to release the clutch? Idk) I'm not home right this minute, but I will def try to turn the motor "backwards" by hand a little to "dislodge" or realign whatever is "jamming". I think my clutch cylinder may need to be bled. Weird considering I didnt disconnect any hydraulic clutch lines. I did notice my resevoir was almost empty.... But that still wouldn't cause the thing to lock up that tight. I'm wondering if maybe I should loosen the bellhousing bolts a little to see if that helps loosen things up? Or maybe put it in gear and try to turn the driveshaft? Anyways thanks a lot guys. Keep the suggestions coming, and I will def let you know what I find! __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

03-17-2011, 02:19 AM	#12
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	Oh and yes I did use a new clutch it was Autozone brand, I used to work there and I've never seen one of there clutches come back. So I figured it was as good as any. The only prob I had was that the bolt holes in the pressure plate didn't line up with the boltholes in the new AM flywheel. I just blamed it on craptastic aftermarket compatibility and drilled new holes in the PXplate. Seemed to bolt up great after that. __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

03-17-2011, 02:27 AM	#13
Travis89Turbo 12psi boost Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Utah Posts: 332	Start with the easy stuff first. Pull the other two plugs and check in the cylinders for fuel (or anti freeze, but that's un likely), then try rotating engine with by rachet, re check timing, recheck dist is installed properly. Double check plug wire routing. then if no more ideas pull trans. But I doubt anything is goin on in there. Which is quite the job with engine in! __________________ 1995 Toyota Supra SE 71k miles. Master power T70 stock 2jzge 1989 Toyota Supra. 1jzgte swap 5 speed of course.. Driftmotion 60-1 single turbo kit. Cxracing FMIC. 2jz 550cc injectors... soon to come..... EMS Stinger. BC 264 cams 680cc injectors Spec stage 4 clutch and A LOT of boost!------SOLD 1999 Ford F350 diesel 2004 Jaguar XJR Supercharged If it hasnt broke you haven pushed it hard enough!!

03-17-2011, 06:12 AM	#14
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	Ok I was about to write a hateful email to CBhaus (regarding the flywheel because I had to drill holes in the pressure plate in order for it to bolt up and i was suspecting that it was causing my "lock up" problems)... ....when i noticed that i had ordered the flywheel for TURBO ONLY!!! WTF how did i miss the HUGE ASTERISKS that said TURBO ONLY ......sigh....well, i think i found the problem guys.....strangely, they LOOKED identical! AND they have the same number of teeth. So what is the difference???? Do you guys think this is DEF the prob? __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

03-17-2011, 08:02 AM	#15
btwilson86 Super Moderator Join Date: May 2007 Location: Billings, Montana Posts: 1,034	I was pretty sure that the turbo flywheel is a larger diameter, by about an inch. I'm not 100% sure, but if thats the case then the flywheel may be jammed against the bellhousing on your w58. __________________ 1989 7MGTE R154 Targa Top White Package w/Blue Interior Driftmotion 57trim CT26, Upgraded Intercooler, 2.25" Hard Pipes, 3" Turbo Back Exhaust with Test Pipe, HKS VPC w/GM 3 bar MAP sensor, APEXi S-AFC, Walbro 255lph fuel pump, ProSport EVO Series Boost / Fuel Pressure / AFR gauges, Lotek a Pillar Gauge Pod, HKS Type 0 Turbo Timer, Eibach Lowering Springs, Tokico Illumina II TEMS struts, custom powder coated Motegi Racing TrakLite wheels

03-17-2011, 09:08 PM	#16
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	Idk this isn't really sitting right with me for some reason. When i got the flywheel I laid it on top of the old flywheel and checked to see if it had the same number of teeth. It was the SAME size and everything. But I crawled under the car today and loosened the bellhousing bolts and I got the engine to turn over (by ratchet) about 1/8-1/4". It wasn't very much but it was more than before. Can anybody confirm the differences in the W58 and R154 flywheels? Either way, I'm dropping the tranny next week so I will def be getting to the bottom of this! I'll keep you posted. __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

03-18-2011, 07:22 AM	#17
btwilson86 Super Moderator Join Date: May 2007 Location: Billings, Montana Posts: 1,034	I can't find reliable sources to confirm this, but what I've read on some other forums and sites is this: 7MGE: 225mm Overall Diameter 7MGTE: 240mm Overall Diameter __________________ 1989 7MGTE R154 Targa Top White Package w/Blue Interior Driftmotion 57trim CT26, Upgraded Intercooler, 2.25" Hard Pipes, 3" Turbo Back Exhaust with Test Pipe, HKS VPC w/GM 3 bar MAP sensor, APEXi S-AFC, Walbro 255lph fuel pump, ProSport EVO Series Boost / Fuel Pressure / AFR gauges, Lotek a Pillar Gauge Pod, HKS Type 0 Turbo Timer, Eibach Lowering Springs, Tokico Illumina II TEMS struts, custom powder coated Motegi Racing TrakLite wheels

03-23-2011, 01:54 PM	#18
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	7mge W58 FLYWHEEL vs 7mgte R154 FLYWHEEL THEY ARE EXACTLY THE SAME IN DIAMETER. HOWEVER, THE 7MGTE/R154 FLYWHEEL IS ABOUT 3/8" THICKER THAN THE ONE FOR THE 7MGE//W58!!!! This is absolutely critical! what happened: I accidentally ordered a flywheel for a Turbo supra. (r154 trans) it was so thick that it positioned the pressure plate nearly 1/2" further towards the rear of the bellhousing. once the bellhousing bolts are tightened down, it binds the pressure plate into the bellhousing and the whole thing locks up tight! VERY VERY IMPORTANT to know!!! Every thing else is the same, number of teeth, overall diameter, bolt pattern, inside whole diameter. The ONLY other thing that MIGHT be different, is the PATTERN of threaded holes for the PRESSURE PLATE BOLTS. i had to ream the pressure plate holes in order for them to line up with the threaded holes in the flywheel. this was my first clue that this was the incorrect flywheel. I made the mistake of thinking "its just the usual aftermarket compatibility". On that note; I have a CHROME-MOLY lightweight flywheel for a turbo supra for sale now. LOL its never been used just bolted up. Ill take $150 firm http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CBHau...Q5fAccessories __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

03-23-2011, 06:06 PM	#19
cre Toyota Racing Development Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 5,038	The flywheels are different in diameter. Been a while since I've had them side by side so I can't say how much. If I recall correctly, the amount you shaved to bring it to 10.5:1 puts the engine very close to now being an "Interference" engine. If the mechanical timing was off by enough you may have hit the valves. __________________ If something breaks or you need to contact a member of the administration please post HERE. Unless it's a private or administration matter please post it on the forum. It benefits no one else if car related questions aren't posted for future users and takes away from the time I'm able to spend helping on the rest of the forum. If you're so inclined I'm always more than happy to accept tips via PayPal. Tip Jar --->

03-23-2011, 07:27 PM	#20
El_supracabra Intake Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South of Columbus, Ohio Posts: 45	I dropped the tranny last night, there were gouges in the inside of the bellhousing and scratches on the high points of the pressure plate. I laid the "turbo only" flywheel on top of my OEM non-turbo flywheel and they were EXACTLY the same diameter and no of teeth. when i laid them side by side the "turbo only" flywheel was about 3/8 to a 1/2" thicker than the OEM non turbo. this was the obvious problem. I had my OEM flywheel resurfaced and i will be putting it back on today. all things permitting. __________________ 86.5 Supra NA: milled head .020, decked block .007, .5mm+ pistons, port & polished intake manifold and cyl head,OBX header, 3-angle, cold air intake, Cometic MLS HG. ALL NATURAL! CHEVROLET- Cracked Heads, Every Valve Rattles, Oil Leaks Every Time FORD- Flipped Over, Rebuilt Dodge DODGE- Dirty Old Dust Gathering Engine I'd rather drive a Toyota, than push a ford.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
car suddenly wont start - never ran great anyway, esp. cold, now cranks, but won't st	rjSupra	MKIII Supra	41	03-21-2014 05:27 PM
87 Supra won't start	RNEMESiS42	MKIII Supra	3	06-25-2011 06:30 PM
Stalling at start up	Green7mgte	MKIII Supra	4	12-15-2009 06:31 PM
My car decides when it wants to start	carfanatic89	MKIII Supra	16	02-12-2008 07:50 PM
Car Died...where to start?	Jrew	MKIII Supra	4	10-26-2007 02:19 PM