Are There Any Honest Mechanics?
 

I had a leaky coolant system and took it to a mechanic my friend had worked for. He found the leak, it was the "upper return hose" and sat just under the distributor. L shaped hose about 4" long. Then he tells me to get it off he will have to remove distributor and this will cost me 225 dollars. When he goes to office I check the hose and can see the worm screw on the side, quite accessible under distributor. I go around to the front and move the fan blade and sure enough, there's the other one. It's a little tight but definitely doable. I says to the guy "Yo, buddy, you don't need to remove the distributor, here are the worm screws right here" and I point em out. He looks all perplexed and says "Oh yeah, alright, it will only cost 165 dollars". I said "What are u freakin nuts" and left. I went to auto parts store and bought hose for 6 dollars and two new worm screws, some anti-freeze and replaced hose. I went to strauss auto and asked them to do pressure check. They did it for a couple of bucks and said it was just fine. Two weeks ago, I went to the mechanic at the gas station I always fill up at. I asked him about putting in an O2 sensor. He said with thick accent "Oh, very difficult job, need special tools". I looked in my book and saw nothing difficult about it. I went to Autozone and bought O2 sensor for 50 dollars and put it on with one socket and a rachet. Is everyone out there to rip me off. How can I find an honest mechanic? Do they exist? I'm startin to get P.O.ed here. I live in North Jersey, and if anyone can recommend someone who they know will be straight with me, please let me know. I had a tune up done in the spring and now I'm wonderin if the guy even took off the throttle body to get to the rear plugs. People Su*k.

James in NJ

get yourself a service manual and a set of tools .

you better keep an eye on the blowing of hoses and water usage

make sure that hose you bought has a formed right angle or you'll be choking water flow at the bend .

do you have a rushing water sound in the morning when you start up ?

has the hose at the back of the block been replaced ? it's got 2 90 degree bends in it .. it might be the next to go

Re: hose
 

Yeah, I definitely bought a 90o hose, I did not just bend a straight hose. I do have manual and tools, but I work 2 jobs, and its dark when I leave for work and its dark when I get home. And lately the weekends have been like Biblical disasters around here. There are some jobs I am a little nervous about tackling. Like taking off that throttlebody, which I would love to do. I'd also like to replace valve cover gaskets as I think they could use it, but everything is so tight under that friggin hood. Anyways, are there honest mechanics out there, or is everyone out to screw me?

James in NJ

What manual are you using? Sounds like you know more than the mechanics to me. And if you think about it, doing somethings for yourself will help in future diagnostics when something goes wrong. But at least you have the common since to not let some greasy mechanic out to make a buck rip you off...good for you!

agreed... learn how to do it yourself :)

but if you are one of those that don't have time at all for that then ask the mechanics the same question... how much to put in an 02 sensor ;)

You Can Do It !!!!!!!!
 

Bring on over to my shop. I know supras well, and I've never ripped anyone off. There is enough work to make a good living, AND be honest.

The ripoffs are just lazy bastards that actually enjoy stealing from you !!

I've fired some when I was foreman at the Toyota dealer.

You don't EVEN wanna know some of the crap those kind do to your car, or don't do, but charge you anyways.

It sounds like you have some mechanical abilities. Get a Chilton manual so you have a reference book to get greasy while you fix things yourself. Use the TSRM, and print out the pages you need to do a particular job.

Ask all the questions here before tackling a job that may lay up your car for a day or 2.

That throttle body will come right off with a 3/8" 12" extension and socket. Those valve covers are easy to get off with a BIG tipped phillips screwdriver.

Make sure you use a fender cover, even a towel.

Take some photos before you start if you need, so you can see where it all goes back.

Get a muffin pan to keep the nuts and bolts seperated as you remove them. This will make re-assembly much quicker, and less headache.

Get all the parts and gaskets ahead of time. Keep 2 cans of 'brake cleaner spray' on hand. A magnetic tray is handy, or an old speaker magnet.

VC gasket job won't take you more than 2 hrs. max.

sorry to but in on this thred

but i keep reading about rushing water sound when cold?
what is this linked to?

Re: Do it yourself
 

I can't find a chiltons book for my specific year supra. I did find a book (forgot name) on supras in general and it is somewhat helpful. The TSRM is very helpful, but I'm afraid of getting in over my head. I saw a site where they show every part and part number in blow ups and the parts separated. I once saw it on a Body Shop Computer. Does anyone know the URL for this? I think this would be very helpful.

Thanks,

James in NJ

Toyota Parts
 

the rushing water/gurgling in your dashboard is due to air in your cooling system
you need to burp it :)

here's a link on 'burping your baby'

http://www.supras.com/06/techcenter/...0f95928a5c87c2

There is plenty of honest mechanics, but the majority give the rest a bad name. i went to meinike for an alignment, And the guy came up to me and said, your car has a whole list of problems. And after i talked all the BS out of him(guess he realized i knew what i was talking about),they told me i needed a new power steering system and wheel bearings to get an alignment. And they wouldnt even let me in the bay to look at the car. they gave me a 450$ estimate to change the bearings, and said they couldnt even get the rack. And this is after a 2+ hour wait in line to get my car on a lift. So i basically gave meinike the finger and decided never to go back there. I took my car to a little shop by me, that my friend goes to, and the guy aligned my car for 70$. Drives perfectly straight, wheel isnt crooked, anything. shows what shopping around can do too.

Honestly, owning a Supra is a good way to learn how to work on a car. The Chilton's manual will tell you pretty much all you need to know. If you MUST take it to a mechanic, shop around...I usually take it to the dealership because at least one or two of the guys have been around long enough to have done some work on a 7m engine (if it gets the the point that I need to have someone else work on it, I've really messed something up!). They may charge you a bit more, but I think it's worth it to know that it's being worked on by someone who knows thier stuff. Now, I am ASE Certified (after I bought my Supra) and personally know all the techs at my local Toyota dealer so I would definitely trust them and sometimes call them up for advice.

Atleast you were able to catch the mechanic before he ripped you off. The mechanic I took my car to charged me for parts I did not okay him to buy. He replaced a perfectly fine turbo hose which ended up costing me 132 dollars. Also parts that worked fine when I took the car in mysteriously stopped working or were broke when he got his dirty little hands on them. He went 500 dollars over his estimate and i only okayed, at max, 150 of it. I have since towed my car to another mechanic, who I can trust (hopefully), and he told me that I will need to replace 2 sensors. It will cost me atleast another 500 dollars to replace the Air Mass Meter and TPS.

Just nosy but what is he trying to fix ? cos the Mass AFM and the TPS that sounds kinda odd.

Long, but informative post
 

^^true....both AFM & TPS bad seems strange. I manage a smog repair shop, so I see these kinds of problems every day, and if only 1 of those items is bad, the car will run bad, or not run at all.

Those parts can be tested individually. Some shops/techs want to just replace parts, and not spend time to diagnose.

Here in Calif. I can NOT charge ANY more $$$ (even if I installed the part, and it ran perfectly with it) until I get the approval of the customer FIRST.

If I did do more than authorized, I can loose the $$ when the customer says he ain't paying it. Of course I can take the part off and put his bad one back on.

Any customer can call the Better Business Beurro(? never could remember how to spell that) or the Consumer Affairs, and complain. Those 2 can make you give them their $$ back, and put a mark against you. 3 marks and you 'could' loose your business license.

Some asshole customers do this on purpose, for free work. In fact, a few years ago we caught a 'lovely, Bible reading couple' doing just this. We knew many of the shop owners, and called to warn them. Finally the couple left town (after their car got all fixed up for free from several shops), and knowbody else would work on it.

They came in complaining that WE called everyone. We actually said to them, "no more pretending to be "Godly Christians, and then ripping off folks" !!! "So get the hell outa here before we call the cops on you for trespassing" !!!

They were pissed off, and we just laughed at them as they drove off.

You see, an honest shop will bend over backwards to try and make things right. And they don't want the BBB or CA getting down on them, so they'll give up the parts and labor to try and make someone happy.
But we know a thief when we see one. And we follow the rules to the "T".

If you don't have a good shop/tech that you KNOW you can trust to not rip you off, keep looking. You CAN'T afford to get ripped.

Like was said in the first post, that elbow hose replacement is a 30-45 min job for a beginner. Not a $200 job.

Also, be careful of the dealerships. Ask around from customers, and shops you trust. The ones in my town are VERY big rip-offs. It's more the service writers than the techs. The writers get paid on commission (as most techs do too). The higher the bill, the more they make. AND, they are under alot of pressure to "get those tickets up there".

I worked at the Toyota dealer here for 4 years, as top tech, then shop foreman. I know the business very well. The $$ generated through the service dept at dealerships pays for all the over-head. The rent, laundry, lights, water, all insurance, etc.

The sales depts, new & used, pays for itself (salaries, bonuses, managers, advertising, porters, etc).

The parts dept pays its own way.

This is why every time you go to the service dept, it cost soooo much.

i.e.: Cadillac Northstar engine oil leak at the pan gasket on one of our customer's cars, dealer=$2000, us=$800.

So many examples of this ripoff I won't bore you.

So be careful where you go.

i am curently in the middle of my automotive apprenticeship, and i've seen a lot and know how this industry works...dishonesty is caused by a "mechanic" that can't make money by being honest, probably because he's lazy or has an addiction he needs to support...there are a lot of scummy people out there that will take advantage of naive people when given the opportunity...there are a few things you can do

1) get a second opinion
2) make friends with a tech (techs are suckers for beer)
3) use your common sense
4) ask questions on this forum
5) learn to do the work yourself, sometimes easier said than done, but it's worth it in the end

Warning, Rant To Follow . . .
 

Ok so all this " honest mechanic " crap ... sorry if it's too full of *itself* or long paragraphs ...

Customer comes in and asks what the dashlights on his van mean. Fuel, handbrake and altenator lights are on while it's runing. They had been comming on and off for a couple of days now, no other problems with the vehicle ( such as overheating from a missing fan belt ). Same-day service sort of thing cos he's a tourist and in a hurry. So I get the job of taking his van appart, the guy hangs out for a bit ( here the boss is fixing his 230V radio for free cos the guy seems cool. Couple other perks to getting his van fixed here. We're like that, multi-skilled and good guys ). Guy takes off on foot somewhere for the day. I take his altenator appart and notice the nice burnt diodes ( someone must've put the leads backwards when it was jump started for them all to go like that ). I take off in the work van to finish off a small mammoth job I started a couple days ago and my boss fixes the altenator and puts it beside the van. At the end of the day the guy comes back and I'm pulled off yet another job ( which was yet another walk-in, but a really good customer ) to put his alt back on. A very busy day or it would have been ready ages ago.

Stupid me doesn't put the belt on right and it flies off the pulley, gets crimped but not broken. Yea don't laugh too hard plz, I ain't happy with it. We can't find another belt for it same day, so we put the buggered belt back on temporary and ask him to come back tomorrow and appologise for all this *yet again*. He has to stay in town overnight. Next day he gets a new belt on URGENT delivery by nine the following am, supplied and fitted free of charge and with a another big fat appology.


Now here's the bit that slotts me off. He comes back, after telling me all is fine ( fuck I hate ppl who can't just say " this isn't good " ), he asks and asks to talk to my boss who was away on a callout. Apparently and you have to look at this from his " point of view " but, and he's " no mechanic, " but it seemed to him that my buggering his v-belt and the alt being buggered had the same symptoms. Therefore the alt was never faulty and the belt had smiply fallen off. And that was the only problem. Apparently I had missed the fact when I took the belt off to get the alt off .... And the boss also missed it when he did the diagnosis work. Right ...

Boss comes back in and tells me this arsehole told him *I* suggested the belt was the only thing wrong. Fucking retard. So I go and talk to him while the boss is hunting through the scrap for this guy's old rectifier and regulator, just to show the guy how visibly damaged they were. I end up explaining to him several times that both *his* fault and the one I caused had similar symptoms, but the guy just isn't listening. Keeps falling back to this stupid line " you have to look at this from my point of view, I'm no mechanic but it seems to me that ... " gist is that the altenator was fine, he isn't disputing that we put new parts in, or accusing us of ripping him off. Just wants to settle on the price, or he'll go get a second opinon and go to the cops if we have ripped him off. Single minded argumenting. Fuck the guy was pissing me off by the time the boss came back out to show him the old bits and point out that if he really wanted to rip the guy off he wouldn't have done a few other jobs for him for free or even taken the alt off the car cos that just took up time. If we really wanted to rip him off we're smart enough to do it well. plus the symptoms were different ( firstly the alt light only came on with the engine running, the other two lights were always on. With the belt being broken all lights were always on ).


Didn't come here intending to post this ... just saw the post and wondered if I'd gotten an answer for the AFM/TPS Q then got to thinking on how sometimes you're not actually being ripped off when you are. Or you're actually trying to rip off by accusing people of ripping you off. No acusations there, I'm just getting really angsty about people who want the earth but wont buy it.

Supratech's advice is good advice.
I'll add
6)only get your car worked on by a tradesman you think you can trust, and don't try to haggle, barter or browbeat after the damn job's done under quote. After all, half of the exchange is how we trust you. Give and take, or there's just no point helping you.

i had a similar thing happen

a 2.8l turbo deisel van came in to get his exhaust leak fixed

exhaust leak was coming from the manifold

we spend about 2 hours removing manifold + turbo etc and find that the exhaust has been leaking for quite some time and blew holes in the gasket and started blowing holes in the manifold surface, also the manifold had been welded before trying to fix another hole (which started cracking)
we quoted him a mere $400nzd/300usd? to get the manifold machined flat again and new gasket and labour inclusive

we actually took the manifold & turbo up to show him what was wrong so he would understand

we then got it machined and all back together and now the exhaust leak is quiet as a mouse (cept for some engine noise which was there the whole time just couldn't hear it clearly due to the exhaust leak)

he pays for the job and takes his van away

the next day he comes down and says....

customer: i can't find the parts you put on, i lifted the passengers (left side of car) seat and everything, you didn't replace anything you just took my money and spent it on something else and didn't touch my car
that thing you showed me had way too many holes for my van and that turbo is way too big for my van

me: um, your van is quiet isn't it (i didn't say... umm your td03 or whatever is on mitsubishi delica vans is wayyyyyyyyyyyy too small for my car LOL)

customer: that doesn't matter you charged me way to much to fix fak all

me: now if you look under your drivers seat you will find that your manifold has been tank cleaned and welded

customer: no you haven't been under there, nothings moved

me: look, we did the job, your van no longer has an exhaust leak which you can clearly hear

customer: rant rant rant keeps going on about how we ripped him off

me: yea whatever dude, we did the job now please stop harassing us


that was about 6 months ago now... and gee, his van is still quiet as a mouse haha
we even told him to go to another mechanic and get them to check it, dunno if he ever did
told him he could ring the reconditioner shop we got it machined at and he said no i won't because he'll be a friend of yours and just tell me whatever you want him to

just one more example of a pig headed customer

Professionals
 

O.K., it seems like you guys know what you are talking about and have been around, so tell me how I should handle a situation like this. I take my car in for major work (new water pump, clutch plate, clutch pump, etc) and I am given a written estimate. The work gets done in a timely fashion but they say they found something else and fixed that. Show's me the worn part and it looks legit, but adds rather large sum to bill. Shouldn't they have called me to O.K the work? What if I didn't have that kind of money on me? I told them to please call next time before doing extra work (politely) but they seem pissed. I even thanked them before for the nice job, just asked for a little professional courtesy in future. Am I wrong here?

Scruff.

absolutely not
they should have phoned you if they were going to replace any other parts not already agreed to

more than likely they probly saw that you wouldn't kick up a fuss if they added something so they took advantage of that

have you paid them yet? (if no....) and...
have you got your car back? (if yes...)

pay em $20 a week LOL

that should annoy them suffiently ;)

You had a written qoute for a very specific list of jobs. That should have been all they did. Should have called you and asked permission. And they shouldn't get pissed at you asking to be told, that just totally lacks professionalism.

If you don't have the money and really don't feel like paying it you could try to " settle " on a moderate price. They could also offer to remove it and reinstall the old one at no charge ... But if you really did need the repair it's prolly not worth an argument, just make sure they don't keep doing crap like that.


Tradesperson/Customer Relationship;
You are their cash cow. If they milk you barren they starve later on. If they don't milk you enough you bloat. If they milk you gently both you and they profit.

I took my supra in to a shop to get a used engine put in. Aftrer it was installed the mechanic told me that the AFM and TPS were bad, which confused me since they worked fine when I brought the car in, so I had to replace them. I didn't have the same mechanic do it though because he left bolts loose, charged me for parts I didn't ok, and he lost a hood bolt and never replaced it. This guy boils my blood.

Now after spending 2800 on my car ( which wasn't expected because the mechanic went 500 over the quote, 140 to tow it to another mechanic, and 455 on the Mass AFM, TPS, and a hose. Thats 1095 more than I intended!) it over heats. I just getting frustrated with all the set backs. I am a senior and now i am forced to ride the bus to school. But anyways I think the problem is a bad fan clutch, but I previously replaced it and it less that 1 week of use. The reason why i think that it needs to be replaced it that it only kicks in when the temp gauge is almost to the red area other wise it does not kick in. (don't worry I pulled off to the side of the road and let it cool down when it reads 3/4) I'm most likely wrong so any help would be very appreciated.

Fuel - You guys get some rogues over there ... checked water, had block and radiator flushed, compression tested, etc ? ( edit - I do understand that you've had these things pointed out, just thought I'd say something clever )


Suprra_girl - notice they're never back to appologise over something like that ? Even ( especially ) if their car is still running better than ever after 6 months or so ?
Hey you had many ppl asking about fuel pumps on Toyota vans now that they've changed the diesel fuel grade ? Ever try explaining to some guy that his van is running so slow because of that, not his glow plugs ... he thought he was being ripped off by the people up the road.

lol yea it would be nice if they did actually give their pride a bit of a kick but then again i don't think i would like a customer like that coming back